Author | Discussion |
TOENHEEL
3468 posts
64 months | Wednesday 14th October 2009 
The Evora is definetly in an area of the market that Lotus havent touched in a long time but i would imagine they will always aim for driver involvment as it seems thats what makes a Lotus. Im really quite excited for the future and seeing the Esprit etc. Its also worth mentioning that Lotus drip feed the BHP inreases on new generations of models etc just like Porsche. The Evora engine has massive opportunity to run a lot more power so lets see what happens in the future and hopefully some scope for an "R" version after seeing the latest pictures of the 24h ring race car which looked stunning.
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Mikeyboy
2693 posts
72 months | Wednesday 14th October 2009
TOENHEEL said:
The Evora is definetly in an area of the market that Lotus havent touched in a long time but i would imagine they will always aim for driver involvment as it seems thats what makes a Lotus. Im really quite excited for the future and seeing the Esprit etc. Its also worth mentioning that Lotus drip feed the BHP inreases on new generations of models etc just like Porsche. The Evora engine has massive opportunity to run a lot more power so lets see what happens in the future and hopefully some scope for an "R" version after seeing the latest pictures of the 24h ring race car which looked stunning.
I personally didn't think it needed more power per se, possibly torque but quick is all it needed as it powered out of corners and carried that speed beautifully through corners. That's only from 1/2hour though and it may be that with time it may be something you want to develop. likewise the Cayman S. yes a few extra horses would be nice but I think a diet would suit it better.
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TOENHEEL
3468 posts
64 months | Wednesday 14th October 2009
Mikeyboy said:
TOENHEEL said:
The Evora is definetly in an area of the market that Lotus havent touched in a long time but i would imagine they will always aim for driver involvment as it seems thats what makes a Lotus. Im really quite excited for the future and seeing the Esprit etc. Its also worth mentioning that Lotus drip feed the BHP inreases on new generations of models etc just like Porsche. The Evora engine has massive opportunity to run a lot more power so lets see what happens in the future and hopefully some scope for an "R" version after seeing the latest pictures of the 24h ring race car which looked stunning.
I personally didn't think it needed more power per se, possibly torque but quick is all it needed as it powered out of corners and carried that speed beautifully through corners. That's only from 1/2hour though and it may be that with time it may be something you want to develop. likewise the Cayman S. yes a few extra horses would be nice but I think a diet would suit it better. Simplify and add lightness as Colin would say 
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jackal
6568 posts
119 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
problem with the evora at the moment is they are only coming off the line in tiny drips
they can't get the interiors up to the quailty, fit and finish that's required so they just aren't coming out the other end
let's hope things improve for them
its a hugely confidence inspring drive.. i don't think ive ever tested a car and within 5 mins been going so fast down twisty country lanes
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heebeegeetee
13316 posts
85 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
shoestring7 said:
I've just read CAR magazines performance car of the year in which they give gold to the Evora above a Gen 2 Cayman, Lambo's etc. I do wonder if Porsche's insistence on suppling test cars with the biggest wheels available counts against them; on 18"s the Caymans' ride and steering response is much better, but Lotus do seem to have produced a car much better suited to UK roads. One point; the Evora's engine is very high and almost over the rear wheels. I wonder if it's natural tendancies are like the Elise's; snap oversteer at the limit especially in the wet and only tamed by chassis and wheel tweaks. Cross section here:  SS7 I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined.
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jackal
6568 posts
119 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
heebeegeetee said:
I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined. have you driven it ?
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chris7676
1186 posts
57 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
jackal said:
heebeegeetee said:
I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined. have you driven it ? Firstly you said the same about the Elise (which is not really true although is more rear engined than a Boxster/Cayman).
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Two Stallions
1329 posts
13 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
But £60K with the must have options! 
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shoestring7
2728 posts
83 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
TOENHEEL said:
I also feel a mid to high 50k Cayman is to expensive. It is. List price for a Gen 2 Cayman S is £44.5k, needs at most £3-4k of options so is still a £40k-ish car. I'm sure its possible to spec. a £55k Cayman, it just wouldn't be any better than one £10k cheaper. SS7
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jackal
6568 posts
119 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
chris7676 said:
jackal said:
heebeegeetee said:
I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined. have you driven it ? Firstly you said the same about the Elise (which is not really true although is more rear engined than a Boxster/Cayman). yes and have you driven an elise ?
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mrdemon
1014 posts
102 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
"just made the Cayman S seem like a stripped out Elise S1"
wtf that's a funny quote if ever I saw one.
Roll on 2010 When Lotus will clearly make the Sports car to beat all sports cars at 60k with the gen 2 Evora 320+ Bhp and some electronics.
But FFS it has no ESP as they dont have the skill to put one in and is slower on the track than a TTRS let alone a Cayman S.
I won't talk about straight line speed where again it's the slower of the 3.
In this case you cannot say the Evora will have it in the corners ;-p it just lacks the power, roll on the next one ASAP.
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TOENHEEL
3468 posts
64 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
shoestring7 said:
TOENHEEL said:
I also feel a mid to high 50k Cayman is to expensive. It is. List price for a Gen 2 Cayman S is £44.5k, needs at most £3-4k of options so is still a £40k-ish car. I'm sure its possible to spec. a £55k Cayman, it just wouldn't be any better than one £10k cheaper. SS7 I can remember evo testing a Cayman with an OTR of 65k  ceramics etc bet the depreciation on that particular car was interesting. I quite like Caymans to be honest although engine problems with our 987 turned me off slightly. I just wish that Porsche would build the Cayman to their full potential instead of holding back so that it doesnt damage the 911 sales as its a much better basis to build a high performance car or even build a bigger brother along with the 911.
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chris7676
1186 posts
57 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
Whethere I have driven one or not, can afford etc is irrelevant when stating the FACTS about the cars  Surely this post is more about behaviour and subjective feelings though, so I can understand the Evora may feel better that the Cayman S which is a faster car (as tested by some).
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heebeegeetee
13316 posts
85 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
chris7676 said:
jackal said:
heebeegeetee said:
I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined. have you driven it ? Firstly you said the same about the Elise (which is not really true although is more rear engined than a Boxster/Cayman). You don't need to drive a car to know where it's engine is, you really don't. Look the Evora is clearly a fantastic handling car, so does it matter where it's engine is? All i know is, Lotus (like other companies) don't build a mid-engined car as far as I'm concerned. I have sat in an Evora though, so i also know that there is no chance whatsoever of sitting adults in one as shown in that pic, none whatsoever. Again, does it matter? To me it would a bit, because you've got that space in the back that in reality will get used for luggage, and i'd rather have the luggage shut firmly away from me when i'm in the car. The biggest thing for me about the Evora though, is that it has reminded the world (and it needed reminding) that rock solid suspension and a hard ride are not at all needed to drive fast, and that poor ride quality is a cop-out and a good ride quality in a fast car is only achieved by those manufacturers who know what's truly what when it comes to building good cars.
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jackal
6568 posts
119 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
heebeegeetee said:
chris7676 said:
jackal said:
heebeegeetee said:
I've been saying this for a long time about transverse 'mid' engined cars. Don't get me wrong, i think Lotus have done a terrific job with the Evora and i wish them all the best with it, but that car in the pic above is not mid-engined. have you driven it ? Firstly you said the same about the Elise (which is not really true although is more rear engined than a Boxster/Cayman). You don't need to drive a car to know where it's engine is, you really don't. Look the Evora is clearly a fantastic handling car, so does it matter where it's engine is? All i know is, Lotus (like other companies) don't build a mid-engined car as far as I'm concerned. I have sat in an Evora though, so i also know that there is no chance whatsoever of sitting adults in one as shown in that pic, none whatsoever. Again, does it matter? To me it would a bit, because you've got that space in the back that in reality will get used for luggage, and i'd rather have the luggage shut firmly away from me when i'm in the car. The biggest thing for me about the Evora though, is that it has reminded the world (and it needed reminding) that rock solid suspension and a hard ride are not at all needed to drive fast, and that poor ride quality is a cop-out and a good ride quality in a fast car is only achieved by those manufacturers who know what's truly what when it comes to building good cars. I agree with you, especially the last paragraph. All I did was try to point out to someone who asked, why the evora isn't snappy and the elise is. It's as much (if not more) to do with vehicle weight and wheelbase than anything else. For example, an elise is snappier and swaps ends quicker than an older gen 911 (which is truly rear engined) largely because of its stubbyness and ~800kg diet. I concur though. When it comes to suspension fettleage for a sporting road car, the evora shows the world how its done. But then you'd expect nothing less from Lotus, they are the undisputed masters in the area of ride/handling balance... eons above everyone else IMO. Needs a tighetr gearchange (a La Exige) and a lower price though 
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AndrewMontgomery
130 posts
32 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
I own an Elise s1 and have done for the past 8 years. Also have a 996tt coming from a 996 C2. I alwsys thought that "mid engined" was fairly loosely defined as the engine's centre of gravity lying between the axles. The Elise's undoubtedly does though perhaps not as much as a Boxster. Weight distribution is something like 62/38 which would back up the idea that its pretty close to the rear axle. But my Elise is an early one and weighs a princely 720kg. Engine plus gearbox is going to make a big difference in the balance of a car that light.
The Elise has steering and feedback that the Porsche could only dream of. With my engine upgraded to 190 hp it feels very accelerative too up to about 70. Being an early car the finish and build quality was very poor. The Porsche a great foil to it. Love them both for different reasons and while I drove the Elise as a daily driver for 4 years I wouldnt dream of it now!
Love to try the Evora but on paper at least it does seem underpowered. That said most Lotuses are.
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Country Boy
208 posts
71 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
I've owned a total of 6 Lotus cars over the years, the last 2 being Elise's - the build quality was an issue on every car. There was no difference with the most recent S2 that I owned. I love driving but I was always frustrated with the flimsy, cheap, badly put together build quality, and issues with little things like the crappy in car entertainment and bin parts used in production. I know Lotus will try hard to fix these sort of issues with the Evora but they will never IMO ever get the build quality up to the benchmark with that of high volume car manufacturers. When I sit in my pride and joy I don't want to see bits of plastic coming adrift, and that's why I love my Porsche - nothing drops off, it's built to last, and it's never let me down.
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shoestring7
2728 posts
83 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
heebeegeetee said:
I have sat in an Evora though, so i also know that there is no chance whatsoever of sitting adults in one as shown in that pic, none whatsoever. I was wondering if anyone would spot the driver's invisible seat! SS7
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TOENHEEL
3468 posts
64 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
The back seats are a joke, im a mere 5'6 and couldnt fit in!!!
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Adam B
4872 posts
91 months | Thursday 15th October 2009
shoestring7 said:
TOENHEEL said:
I also feel a mid to high 50k Cayman is to expensive. It is. List price for a Gen 2 Cayman S is £44.5k, needs at most £3-4k of options so is still a £50k-ish car. EF bizarre mathematics
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